Talk:Quest List
Page too long? Wow, this is a long page. I vote we (eventually) just list quest names here, and create a separate page for each actual quest, once the quest template is done. Or would that be too much work? --Hav0c 03:55, 9 February 2009 (UTC) : That's a good suggestion, but right now the Quest List offers a functionality no other page does: it summarizes rewards for each quest. But maybe we could try to do just what you're proposing, once the migration is complete AND we have created a page for each quest, in the old Quest Index. If that page works fine, maybe we could change this one to that system Scarbrow 06:26, 9 February 2009 (UTC) : Page formatting is complete. I quite like the way it looks: there are comments on the code stating how to maintain that aspect. We can try your suggestion once we've finished. BTW, I suggest we don't start using your Quest template directly on the main page. Better a Quest List Sandbox Scarbrowtalk 17:38, 10 February 2009 (UTC) :: On the question of separating each quest into its own page, that seems too decentralized to be user friendly. Having them all in one page also makes it hard to find the particular one you're looking for. My suggestion would be to put the various quests on the pages for their locations (as has already been done with Saarngard Isle, for instance). Make redirects to that page for particular quest titles. That way, someone can go to the location and quickly see what quests they might not have found yet, or search for a particular quest in the search box and be immediately directed to the right page. Of course, there are a few quests that span multiple locations, and might need their own pages, with just a link from each specific location. ::: I think the planned organization to have quest summaries on the quest list, and individual quest pages with all the details, works well. You can still look at the summaries by location here, or search and go to the individual page. K!ZeRotalk 21:18, 17 April 2009 (UTC) :::: Maybe we can have it both ways. Why not put links for individual quest pages on the location pages, too? ::::: Yup, I hope to have that too, with links on location pages to either the quest list questbox or individual quest page. K!ZeRotalk 19:52, 18 April 2009 (UTC) Abandoning adventures The introductory paragraphs state that adventures can be abandoned and restarted any time, but I believe that there are a fair number that can't be abandoned like that, at least not throughout. I think Westwold, The Murk, and The Ghost Ship are some. K!ZeRo 08:14, 27 February 2009 (UTC) : I've added some notes about that. Please check them out and add/correct/link as necessary Scarbrowtalk 19:27, 27 February 2009 (UTC) Began update to questbox template, found a bug I think the questbox template is good to go, and will work through and update quests to the template as I perform them. But one thing to fix is: If you look at Meglasmire, the Table of Contents does not have the "AG" tag. I looked at the template, but don't want to mess around with it. But I believe it needs to "anchorencode" portion to add " (AG)" depending on the AG parameter. (Hav0c, you could probably quickly fix this..) K!ZeRo 02:07, 8 March 2009 (UTC) : I don't consider it to be a bug. The anchorencode specifies only the name of the quest because it was established that you should be able to link from any place to a quest in the Quest List by typing Quest List#NameOfQuest, that effect would be lost through the addition you propose. In any case, you shouldn't be seeing the full TOC, since we're using to avoid cluttering of the page. Scarbrowtalk 15:13, 11 March 2009 (UTC) :: I might be wrong about anchorencode being the parameter to change; I meant more that if we desired a questbox to show up in the TOC, I feel that the AG tag should probably show up as necessary. I agree that the quest link should just be the quest name, so if the change isn't possible without altering the method of linking, then that's okay. For now, I think I will circumvent the issue by making Meglasmire (the quest) separate from a new Meglasmire (the location) section, which I had wanted to do anyway. K!ZeRotalk 06:48, 12 March 2009 (UTC) : I could 'correct' this, but that would mean that we would have to link to quest names also using the '(AG)' bit. I'm not sure that's a good idea. --Havoc(talk) 18:27, 16 March 2009 (UTC) :: I guess we don't need to change anything, as long as questboxes are not linked from the TOC. I plan on organizing the Quest List so that the TOC lists locations as separate sections, and the appropriate questboxes go under the location sections. And a related task would be to link quests from the individual location articles to the anchor on the Quest List. K!ZeRotalk 18:47, 16 March 2009 (UTC) : I'm not sure if this is related to the same problem as what you guys are discussing above, but I noticed that the questbox does not allow you to use a different link in the title. For example, if I wanted to link to Sageholt, but I made the title to be displayed as 'A hidden cave in the midst of the wood (Noted Location)' the title gets messed up. I'm assuming that all quest pages using the questbox have to be made the exact same title of the quest. Is there a way around it? I'm also under the impression that a quest namespace has been set up and is being tested atm. Any explanation about how this will tie in with the organization of the quest page will be welcome. --Wetheril 10:45, 11 May 2009 (UTC)talk ::Yes, the Questbox title must be the name of the quest, both for current consensus convention (see Template_talk:Questbox#About_Quest_Documenting) and because of how the template is currently built. In the link you'll also find a detailed explanation of the proposed Quest pages/Questbox/Quest namespace system Scarbrowtalk 00:02, 12 May 2009 (UTC) Replayable Scenarios: Where should they be listed? I think this was briefly mentioned before, but I thought I'd ask the question again--should replayable scenarios be listed on the Quest page? Currently, I don't see a link on the main page, the Adventure Guide, or the current quest list that points players to replayable scenarios. So, exactly where should they be listed? --Wetheril 08:32, 11 May 2009 (UTC)talk :That's a good question, and one we don't currently have an answer for. We don't even have a Replayable Scenarios page, so the Template:Replayablelist is missing an important link, too. I think we should create that page, either as a stand-alone one, or a redirect to either Template:Replayablelist or Category:Replayable Scenarios. Then that page should be linked from the Adventure Guide and from Grinding. Because I don't really believe they are properly quests (even if some are parts of quests, and some have quests as part of them), I don't think we should list them here on Quest List, save for maybe a small note at the beginning of the page indicating why we don't list them, and linking to them. Everybody, please comment on these suggestions or add your own Scarbrowtalk 00:12, 12 May 2009 (UTC) ::I'm on board with your suggestion, of either of having a Replayable Scenarios page or redirect that the Adventure Guide (and Grinding) can link to. Perhaps the same could also go for Multiplayer Scenarios, since a current collective page for it also doesn't exist. --Wetheril 00:25, 12 May 2009 (UTC)talk :::I've done most of it. Multiplayer scenarios are included in Replayable template, so I don't think we need another page Scarbrowtalk 03:20, 13 May 2009 (UTC) Questboxes transclusion: an example I've adapted the first quest to the new system, see Quest:The Old Cathedral and Quest List#The_Old_Cathedral. My edit summary was wrong, by the way: we don't need more headinglevels. I think we should write a guide for people that hasn't been here from the start, to show the process more clearly. I suggest :How to document Items and Quests as a title. It should include references and summary of Template:QuestPreload, Template:ItemPreload, Template:ItemEditintro, Template:QuestEditintro, how to use them from the boxes in the Main Page (thanks Hav0c), the discussions from Template talk:Questbox, Template talk:Itembox, Sryth_Wiki_talk:Community_Portal#Collating_Item_information and Sryth_Wiki_talk:Community_Portal#New_namespaces, and of course if we're still thinking of using the Labeled Section Transclusion extension (I think it won't be necessary anymore). Best people for doing it, I'd think Hav0c, K!ZeRo, maybe Wetheril or Shadowblack, and of course me. Everybody who thinks they understand the big mess we have in here can contribute, of course. Me, I won't be able to write more until... say 12 to 16 hours from now, I'm going to bed in mere minutes. Scarbrowtalk 04:15, 12 May 2009 (UTC) : I will try to create/edit the guidelines after digesting some of the preload stuff (seems pretty nifty). I think we can still use Labeled Section Transclusion, but it deals more with "locations" than "quests", although it'd be used on the Quest List in addition to location pages. I'll make an effort to get to it before the weekend. K!ZeRotalk 03:22, 13 May 2009 (UTC) Ashlyre How do we get Ashlyre/Fogbough into this list without disrupting the current layout? Am I being too cautious?--Hastifer 15:15, 10 June 2009 (UTC) :Attack on Ashlyre is a Trithik adventure, if I'm not mistaken, so it should be listed there. If there are adventures happening in Fogbough, you can add a level 3 heading Fogbough below The Ironshore Hollows region of Lake Ironrain, in the Western Tysa region. Scarbrowtalk 21:44, 10 June 2009 (UTC) ::Added it... *gulp*--Hastifer 17:26, 11 June 2009 (UTC) Show/Don't show Rewards: A compromise I suggest that we have two reward entries -- one in the main/spoiler page of a quest, and a summary reward that shows in the box/nonspoiler page of a quest For example, with the The Missing Standing Stone Jewel quest, we could add something like the following within the 'Questbox' section: |Rew = Items, 128-144 General XP, 0-64 Specific XP with the more detailed Rewards listed thusly: Rewards * Darkfire Blade * Blackbone Amulet (initially unidentified), see Neck Armour * Black Bone Key * 8 experience to Fortification if used against the fire at Location 4 * From opening the chest at Location 4 :* 16 xp to General if you use the Black Bone Key (from Location 3) :* or 8 xp to Destruction/Telekinesis * Ring of Dark Valour (initially unidentified) from Location 4, see Ring of Dark Valour * 128 general experience for completion * 32 experience to Arcana if used (after the quest) to identify the unidentified items --Hastifer 16:31, 17 June 2009 (UTC) :I think there are two problems with your suggestion: #How much detail to add without making it a spoiler #Is it really necessary to know beforehand? We already have parameters for the valuable AT and for the also valuable (for purists) AS&P rewards. Will it make any difference if you also know there is some item to be had? I'm supposing that you won't say the exact item, which I would consider a spoiler. And as for XP... we all know that the bulk of the XP to be had in this game comes from grinding. I for one wouldn't turn my face at a quest just because it won't give me so much XP (with the possible exception of the Durnsig rat hunt, too long and repetitive quest for a really meager reward). :As a summary, I see it as largely unnecessary. Scarbrowtalk 19:54, 17 June 2009 (UTC) :: 10-4 ... This was mainly an idea to make it so that we can put the quest boxes on this Article, so that it "keeps its word" by showing the rewards. Currently if we box a quest in this Article, we have to manually show the Rewards -or- forgo boxing them (or show the more notable Reward Types in Notes -- maybe that's the way, but still keeping things unnamed). :: :: And I see your point about the XP (which also indirectly incriminates any gold mention). This actually makes it easier. :: :: So maybe more like this? -- RewTypes=Unique Items, New Quests, Specials (always plural, even if the reward category is ), with only the detail showing up on the main quest article? :: Valid entries for Reward Types would be (without naming anything, even if the name is "Random") -- :: * Unique Items :: * New Quests :: * Specials (includes odd things like free skills/powers or stat boosts -- lets readers know it is "Special" but without saying how) :: :: Or maybe it is just better to add tags for those with a true/false value instead of a RewardsTypes flag that can be corrupted by editors who don't read instructions *gulp* :: :: So could we instead have tags uniqueitem= unlocks= and specials= or something to that effect? :: Hastifer 20:41, 17 June 2009 (UTC) ::: There are certainly many unique quests with unique rewards, but the question is precisely that they're unique. What use is to signal that they are unique? Each and every quest is. What need could I have to know that they offer me a special item? And even if I know that there's a special item in store, it's not the same thing at all if we're talking about the old hag's ring in Hawklor or the demoness' ring in Tarn, isn't it? I stay by my previous position: too little info, and it's irrelevant; too much, and it's spoilerish. Scarbrowtalk 20:19, 19 June 2009 (UTC) I miss the map on the old wiki This page is cumbersome, neolithic and about defeats the purpose of a 'readily accessible source of Sryth quest information and knowledge'. My suggestion is that it be broken down by map quadrants, such as Northwest Tysa, Western Tysa, etc, much like the old wiki's Kingdom of Tysa page. 14:22, 17 July 2009 (UTC)Maskull : It actually exists here, too -- Kingdom of Tysa. Also, the map is accessible on the left side, beneath Game Mechanics (and it branches out into the main quadrants when you hold your mouse over it) : --Hastifertalk 16:28, 17 July 2009 (UTC) Transcluding Location pages Hi, I want input from you on my new test: Transcluding questpages for a location into that location's page (between tags) and then transclude the location page into the Quest List. My original test was to see if we could get Quest List out of the Category:Pages with too many expensive parser function calls, but seems that's not possible by transcluding it in two steps. However, this system would keep Quest List's code really clean. What do you all think about it? I've changed the Trithik and Residence sections. Scarbrowtalk 10:49, 17 August 2009 (UTC) : I like it. The tags are great! Sorry haven't had much time for editing of late. But I am still "alive" and enjoying Fogbough.--Hastifertalk 16:18, 17 August 2009 (UTC) :: Judging from the comment below, maybe I wasn't as alive as I thought. However ... :: I've transcluded (some partially, since not all are Quested up): :: Mirgspil, Port Hallik, Talinus, Hawklor, The Goblinclaw Inn, Zumryn's battlegrounds, Graldok :: The partially transcluded ones are the ones that still have the walkthrough or rewards on this page. :: All the same, this article is still in the category, but that is all the time I have right now.--Hastifertalk 18:25, 20 August 2009 (UTC) This page is now in Category:Pages with too many expensive parser function calls This page is now in Category:Pages with too many expensive parser function calls Could this be because we have too many boxed quests here? If so, I am thinking of how the Category:All Quests works quite well to "list" the quests. The protest I hear in my mind's ear is "what about grouping by location?!" Well -- maybe we could make 9 new Quest subcategories (and that's it, really!) -- groan -- but maybe "Quests in NW Tysa", "Quests in N Tysa", "Quests in NE Tysa", etc., would suffice? I hear the argument against this -- too many lumped on one page -- but, well, we already have that issue, right here on this page. Still, for areas with disproportionate quantities of quests, we might want to subcategorize further? Just food for thought, as usual. (A little speculation, too, heh.) --Hastifertalk 17:41, 20 August 2009 (UTC) : Gah, I'm a dolt today, didn't see the other message directly above, but still.... --Hastifertalk 17:41, 20 August 2009 (UTC) : I've fixed it. As you can see in http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Template_limits#Expensive_parser_function_calls, among the "expensive" function calls is the #ifexists function, which is used on Template:Questbox to decide the color of the Title. I could have removed that feature entirely, since it's improbable that we use again the Questboxes as we once did, by embedding it on other pages than theirs, but I've decided to keep it. What I've done is, quite simply, make the template look for "Who's calling me?" and if it's the Quest List, then it forces directly the title color to white. I doubt any other page will have as many calls to Questbox as to trigger that limit again, but if that happens, we'll see. Completely removing that call will be still possible. : About the subcategories, that would have to be manual work. There's no way to automate the region categorizing. And if we're going to have to do it manually, we can keep the Quest List as it is (it groups quests by location, and that was the original purpose, isn't it?). :What I'm seeing is that Quest List could be just a collection of transcluded regions (the 9 points of the compass, Kuyl-Thanor, Saarngard Isle, the Residence, and any other added in the future). Each region would then transclude its sub-regions. However, that would lead to some complications on some regions, so maybe the best is just what we're doing right now: a transclusion for each heading. And that way, the Quest List would be finally a mirror of Kingdom of Tysa. One page would be more "expanded", the other more "graphical", but both would serve the same purpose: leading to the Locations pages that would host the Quest ones. :Scarbrowtalk 00:26, 21 August 2009 (UTC)